The Spoonpluggers Forum

Hey old timers, I see a lot of talk here about how great the fishing can be in the mid/late fall for sm and lm bass, my experience is that it is feast or famine, mostly famine. I am in my rookie spoonplugging season, learning to run the lures and map structure, so although my primary focus is on these 2 things, i still would like to know what set of weather and water conditions are most conducive to good fish movements this time of year;eg falling, rising water temps, light conditions, etc. Those fronts really roll through here every few days this time of year, and i don't seem to be getting many long or shallow movements here. I have been gritting my teeth and staying with the first 3 sizes until i get more proficient with them, and have not moved deeper, following the program laid out in the book. John, seeing that stringer of fat ones you posted up is making me want to call in sick and clip on those 100-700-800 series!

feast or famine, mostly famine.

I am in my 6th season and this is my first real fall experience and I couldn't agree more. Out three times this week "NO FISH". Don't take it personal.

I have been gritting my teeth and staying with the first 3 sizes until i get more proficient with them, and have not moved deeper, following the program laid out in the book.

This MAY be a problem. This time of year the fish are bunching up in the deep water. Yesterday's stringer picture that John posted - all the fish were caught in 25 to 38 feet. Slightly beyond the range of the first 3 sizes...Now you're not out of the game by a long shot but you're going to need to make some changes in your lake choices.

No matter what you must follow the procedures. Start in the shallows, work your way out as far as you can effectively reach. Any more than that and you're wasting your time. Now if you can run the first three sizes correctly then go bigger. The first full season of the first three sizes can be put aside...I think I was running wire and 800's very early. You just have to accept a 3-stooges like performances for a while.

Now what can you do if you can't reach 38 feet? Look at your lake selections. Find some shallow lakes that have holes in them where the deep water is over 10' but less than 15'. Hopefully the weeds have died back to less than 10' otherwise these lakes won't work. If you have some of these lakes, work the hole completely even casting into the deepest spots. These areas could be quite small.

I don't know what the water temp is but I look for water temp around 45 degrees which indicates to me lake turn over. If you have water still in the 50's you could be in pre-turnover and that could be causing you problems. The closer to turnover it seems the fish move south. After - well they tell me the feed bag really goes on. I have yet to find that. But I know turn over has occurred. I just have to find the right lake.

John, seeing that stringer of fat ones you posted up is making me want to call in sick and clip on those 100-700-800 series!

John's a FREAK. I think he can find a fish in a glass of water. Denny caught 3 muskies yesterday during the same time period and some other Indiana guys have done quite well too.

Keep your chin up and keep working it (I am telling myself the same thing) it will pay off eventually.
Do what you can do and relax. John and others posting stuff here have been Spoonplugging a long time and they have the luxury of having specific spots to fish on many lakes. So they are being efficient and fishing productive water immediately where you and I as beginners will need to wander around a bit. It will happen for us but it will take some time. Just keep working and going out fishing.

Now I have to go fishing, maybe I can catch something...
Morning

Good advice.....
I too was like you for many years when i started out. I was so successful with the fist 3 sizes, I just stay there with them. But, you need to start using the rest of them. This is when you really start to gain knowledge, and get better.By now you should know where your possible structures are, as the first three sizes start to show you what is there. ( unless you are on a Highland Res) Then pick one and start running the 200,100,700,800 sizes and make straight line passes, using markers, and map out your structures just like it says in the Green Book and the Home Study Course.
Pretty soon running an 800 will be as easy as running a 400. You wont believe why you didnt do it sooner.
Keep plugging away. Dont give up or get discouraged, as you will get better and better.
Steve

Bassdawgie wrote:, i still would like to know what set of weather and water conditions are most conducive to good fish movements this time of year;eg falling, rising water temps, light conditions, etc. Those fronts really roll through here every few days this time of year, and i don't seem to be getting many long or shallow movements here.

Don't worry about the weather this time of year, just go fishing whenever you can.

Fran Myers wrote:

John and others posting stuff here have been Spoonplugging a long time and they have the Luxury of having specific spots to fish on many lakes. So they are being efficient and fishing productive water immediately where you and I as beginners will need to wander around a bit. It will happen for us but it will take some time. Just keep working and going out fishing.

Now I have to go fishing, maybe I can catch something...
Morning

We all have that Luxury thanks to Mr. Perry.
1. Go to your best structure
2. Find the fastest break, breaking into the deepest water in the area
3. Stay there to you run out of gas or it's to dark to safely put the boat on the trailer.

Good Luck
Bink

Bink wrote: We all have that Luxury thanks to Mr. Perry.
1. Go to your best structure
2. Find the fastest break, breaking into the deepest water in the area
3. Stay there to you run out of gas or it's to dark to safely put the boat on the trailer.

Good Luck
Bink

Bink, Of course your right.
I said luxury based on John and Denny having deep water contact points already. They know the line sights, anchoring positions, and trolling passes. If you already mapped and figured out the specific spots, the luxury is you just have to troll or cast the very specific spots. You don't have to spend the time going through the procedures to find the spots first. Great luxury to have when movements are very short.

If you've spent the whole season with the first 3 sizes of Spoonplugs, you don't have deep water contact points. I have a few but another luxury is that the longer you have been Spoonplugging the more spots on different lakes you have. As a beginner, we read reports of others and instead of being made to feel better we begin to feel like failures. But it's hard work and we all must remember that experience, time on the water, and persistence is what makes us all better.

Bassdawgie, I know that with enough time and effort you will catch the fish you see pictured here. Keep at it.

Many moons ago I would get frustrated with the lack of the really big bass catches. The old pics in the green book would just make my blood boil. Not mad at those who made those great catches but mad at myself. And the worst thing is not knowing why. This basicly boiled down to I did not know enough at the time. I had not seen much beyond a natural lake in my life. Here is what changed. I began to go to the outings in the south. There I got to fish pickwick. I saw my first delta situation and lost all of my 200's on them and everyone else did too. Still not much success but a lot of knowledge gained. We went there for several years in a row. Pickwick was my first time in having to deal with current. Then came Lake Chicamauga at the old Jamboree's. We saw more and learned more and met people that were way ahead of us and they shared and we listened and went out and did what they said. With that came more knowledge. With that knowledge comes confidence. We came home and in the late 80's, we learned how important water color was. It was in the book but we did not see!!!!!!!! The fish populations have to be there to make a great catch also. Some are better than others. One of those spoonpluggers that I met that opened up my mind was Frank Hamill. He is the one that took my mind from someone who just went through the motions to one that becomes a thinker. It never hurts to be on the water every chance you get either. The learning comes much faster, if you are willing to put forth the effort. It was not easy for any of us. We all struggled at one point or another and did that for years. If you are alone with no clubs or never attend any of the outings where you can meet those that can get you going, then it will take more time. It is always harder and takes longer to accomplish any task totally on your own with no help. Mr. Perry's guidelines are simple and right on the money. Stick with it and success will come. It may take you years but so what. None of us got it over night. It is such a great thing to have fishing independence but you just cannot learn it all. There are too many variables in fishing that a person can get good enough to make a catch each and every time they are on the water. However, it does happen often enough to keep you fired up!!!!!!! That catch that I posted was from a lake close to home that I told myself that I was going to start fishing that thing and fish it all through the turnover and know exactly what the fish are doing till the ice comes on. Usually I say that and dont do it but I have spent a lot of time on this one lately and have stuck with it. You see the results. These fish were only a third of what it could have been. Many more were hooked and lost. ??????? It happens. I am using this lake for an example of what we did and where we found the fish (depths and speeds) from a couple of months ago till the present. It will be in the next national newsletter. I need to get started on it. I told Duplex I was going there last weekend to get a good pic to use for the next article He thought I was kidding.... Keep working hard and it will come. John

Fran, As always i am honored to receive your take on my situations. My "first season" has consisted so far of two 4-hour sessions on the little 350 acre lowland lake i have selected as my training ground, Lake Linville in Mt Vernon, Ky. I chose it for its proximity to home (15 miles), decent yellow-green water color, clean bottom and workable 38' maximum depth. It does not have very much well-defined structure, but has many submerged roadbeds, culverts,channel, bridge, etc. I hope to get there Wednesday for an all day trip, weather has been stable for 4 days with light cloud cover and 70 the predicted high temp. I plan to work on boat control and trolling the first 3 sizes for about half the day, then going to straight line passes on anything interesting with 100-700 series. I also plan to briefly run the wire, just to get the feel of it. Just installed a Humminbird 1197 si on my boat, and am going to play with it briefly, mainly to check for breaks associated with the old bridge and roadbed. I am going to be a busy, happy boy. Bink, I think you have got the proper attitude, i am defintely going to burn some daylight and gasoline. I am going to find that contact point! The consensus seems to be that those magical shallow fall movements most often occur after turnover on stable weather conditions, so I may be on the money! Dwight

John, I know what you mean about blood boiling, i see those big hawgs you all post up, and it shows me that is being done here and now, "by the book". I am kind of a lone ranger here in central ky, no club and the contact in the Louisville club is obsolete. I plan to work on my mechanics and mapping this winter, and book a certified instructor trip in the spring, or sooner time and weather permitting, and make an outing when available.This is why i have been crying for video (hint hint), some of them are great tools for cold weather learning. Jim hooked me up with some Dickson classroom stuff, and i found the On the water mapping on ebay, this was pretty good stuff about using the depth finder to locate and mark breaklines, sharper breaks, etc,things not discussed in the book. Really looking forward to your video coming out. Dwight

I am not sure two 4-hour sessions really give you enough experience to really work much past the 200. So I will presume you have more experience than that. If not well...Keep working the smaller lures. Try going to the bigger lures somewhat carefully. I would NOT try wire just yet. Next I would find the bars that stick out the farthest, anchor and start fan casting the deeper water.

Boat control...Throw some markers and make your passes as straight as possible. Let some amount of line out. 5 or 6 layers. Go straight across the bar. If the lure doesn't hit turn around and try going a little shallower. Try not adding line until you hit. If you do hit, let it snack hard if you have too much line. As soon as the lure stops bumping turn the boat and go parallel to the last pass. You should see your wake. Just go a boat width deeper. Do not add line until you go across the bar and you don't hit it. Then add one layer. Repeat. At some point you will either not reach or the bar will stop. Anchor on the end and cast. Now you've fished the bar.

You shouldn't need to add line because when your lure hits the bottom is pulls the belly out of your line. It's possible to get more depth than the lure is supposed to go just by walking it down in this way.

Tips...
*What helped me to keep situational awareness is to always know where the deep water is relative to my position. If you can't point to the deep water related to the structure your fishing, reel in and find it. Area of the structure closest to the deepest water in the area is the contact point.

*When turning while trolling, I find it easier to turn toward the deep water. IE - if the deep water is on the left, I turn to the left.

*When turning while trolling, accelerate in the turn. The turns can be quite tight but I have found that the tighter the turn the faster you need to go.

*Pay attention to where the line is. Accurate mapping only happens when the line is straight behind the boat.

I think it's great you got a new Humminbird (I just got a new Lowrance HDS a couple of days ago). However the best GPS maps, the best sounder, the best rods, reels, lures will not get you results without following the procedures and knowledge found in the books. Some of the best spoonpluggers I know have nothing but an old flasher. I love new stuff and I have much more space age tools than I ever write about but I could not catch 1 fish unless I followed the Spoonplugger Guidelines.

John and Fran,

Well said, and a good reminder to all of us...it does take time and effort to be a Spoonplugger.

Good Fishing,

TN Dave

Bassdawgie wrote:John, I know what you mean about blood boiling, i see those big hawgs you all post up, and it shows me that is being done here and now, "by the book". I am kind of a lone ranger here in central ky, no club and the contact in the Louisville club is obsolete. I plan to work on my mechanics and mapping this winter, and book a certified instructor trip in the spring, or sooner time and weather permitting, and make an outing when available.This is why i have been crying for video (hint hint), some of them are great tools for cold weather learning. Jim hooked me up with some Dickson classroom stuff, and i found the On the water mapping on ebay, this was pretty good stuff about using the depth finder to locate and mark breaklines, sharper breaks, etc,things not discussed in the book. Really looking forward to your video coming out. Dwight

Welcome to the life of the "lone gunfighter".
It's almost axiomatic that when you take up spoonplugging, your fishing friend list will begin to dwindle. Finally there will be nobody on it but you and your son or daughter.
(and that suited me just fine)
Regards,
Douglas

Douglas, Sure glad to see you decided to join us again. We thought you were dead!!!!!!!! Long time, no hear...... Yes, when you become a spoonplugger, be prepared to be hammered by all, including friends. Deep down in their heart, they know who catches the fish. I have always enjoyed any and all of the critics, the more they say, the better I like it. Motivation is a good thing. For me....... I just really enjoy what I do. It will take death to make me quit..... Sure would be nice Douglas if you could take the time to come to the Jamboree at Kentucky Lake. Might ask you to come up on stage and tell a story or two. I bet the group would like that. Take Care John

If there is a city nearby where I can fly into, I will come and rent a car and then find a motel to stay. I hate driving that far from here.
I won't be bringing any fishing stuff so somebody is going to get stuck with me in the boat with them..(I pay well and I pick up all the expenses too)
As far as camping and sleeping in the woods...well those days are gone too. I can still sit around the fire and tell lies with the best of them though...then its off to that motel bed for me.
I have become an old softie...and I like it.
I will be watching conversations about this as it moves along toward the date.
(by the way, I am not handicapped or unable to take care of myself so I will not be a burden to anyone...I am just lazy)
Regards,
Me

Doug,
I will be by myself. You're welcome to a seat in my boat. I will have all the stuff you need.
Fran

Fran Myers wrote:Doug,
I will be by myself. You're welcome to a seat in my boat. I will have all the stuff you need.
Fran

You got a deal.
I am one of the best when it comes to netting fish. You gonna' like having me around. (except when I fall asleep up there in that seat for my short naps...then you net 'em yourself)
If I cause you to lose a spoonplug due to my running too much line, not keeping that rod tip close to the water, or as Buck says..."using vigorous rod action", I will pay $$ for the losses for which I am guilty. Also I pay all gasoline, launch fees, and you get 50 bucks pocket money just for putting up with me. And that's for each day too.
Just think, you might get to hear me play my harmonica and sing too.
Regards, Douglas<===what a guy!
LOL
LOL
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