500 SP: Cast with or without a snap ?

NoMuskyJoe · Post by **NoMuskyJoe** » Sun Mar 06, 2016 3:31 pm

When casting for sunfish/bluegills/crappies with 4 lb test and a 500 SP: is it better to cast with a snap attached or to just tie the line directly to the split ring ?

If a response is to cast with a snap, would it be a standard #2 or #3 size snap, or because the 500 SP is so small to use a smaller size snap? If so, what size would you recommend ?

Appreciate your help with this, thanks!

Team9nine · Post by **Team9nine** » Sun Mar 06, 2016 7:48 pm

Personally, with the little 500, I prefer to tie directly to the split ring when casting.

-T9

: SP_Crappie.png (551.39 KiB) Viewed 3109 times

Fran Myers · Post by **Fran Myers** » Mon Mar 07, 2016 3:53 pm

A lot people including me would rarely make the effort to cast a 500. To be quite honest, I find the 500 the most challenging of all the sizes including the JB's. One of the secrets to getting the dang thing to work for me is to use lighter line and snaps. often times I will use a spinning rod or light casting rig.

I never really gave it much thought until I read a story about Mr. Perry casting a 300 from a bridge, breakwater, of some sort of shore position. Casting, letting line out, and letting the thing sink into a hole. I recall something about swirling water. I think the depths were somewhat deep 15-20 feet but I am not certain. Anyway, it was a matter of patience and he caught fish. Per usual. Note: the 300 was the 500 before. there were 3 different 300's. The standard 500 like, one made out of Aluminum, and another I can't remember if they were thicker metal to go deeper. I believe there was a time when they were also called 3m, 3a, 3h. I am stepping on a LOT more knowledgeable toes so I encourage anyone who can correct me please do. I believe the rarest Spoonplug is the aluminum 300.

So congratulations - if casting a 500, 800, or even a JB (don't laugh I know guys who do) you ARE Spoonplugging Correctly.

Snap v No Snap...
The ring on the Spoonplug was designed to turn or spin. Call it lubrication. If you tie the line directly to the ring - the lure will work but what will happen is the tiny tab of metal you tie to will erode much faster than normal. Do it long enough and you will retrieve a metal ring without a lure attached. If you look at any of your existing Spoonplugs you use a lot you might see chunks of metal missing from the tab.
The answer you are looking for may include a size smaller than you stated. I would START with the smaller size and work smaller. if you can't get decent action.

Also be aware that 500's are VERY sensitive to tuning. I have yet to get it right.

Great Job and don't be surprised if something much bigger doesn't eat your 500. It's amazing the huge fish that end up eating that darn thing.

Fran

John Bales · Post by **John Bales** » Mon Mar 07, 2016 4:56 pm

Always use a snap with a spoonplug. Like Fran said, the split ring is made to spin and needs to spin for the lure to give the best action. The 500 doesn't pull very hard so you may take a long time to wear out the metal but I can guarantee you that if you tie directly to the split ring and troll with the larger lures, you wont have them very long.

Bink, Holey bonkers, you must have had a ball. Like Brian said "A school of fish"? Is there still such a thing around here? Way to go. John

Steve Craig · Post by **Steve Craig** » Mon Mar 07, 2016 5:42 pm

Always just used a snap from Buck's Baits with all the Spoonplugs.
Jim Vaughn showed me how to tie a Loop Knot, and I personally believe it works better with the smaller 500 and 400 Spoonplugs.
Just my 2 cents

Bink · Post by **Bink** » Mon Mar 07, 2016 5:50 pm

To be honest I don't think casting a 500 will be your best option for catching panfish. Yes it will cath them but if they are that shallow you can use just about anything to cath them.
John & Brian yes a school of bass. Luckily we still have a couple lake with schools of bass (large mouth & small mouth). They have GREAT water color, warm water year round, the lakes are for fishing/hunting only no recreational boating and only open sun up - sun down for 6 months.
Tryin to wiggle my way out of work tomorrow so I can go again

NoMuskyJoe · Post by **NoMuskyJoe** » Wed Mar 09, 2016 9:06 pm

Everyone... Thanks for your comments/feedback... all very informative and helpful and I will apply when I am able to get out on the water ! I plan on casting the 500 SP with a light action 6' / UL 9' rod, 4 lb test in hopes of catching my first fish on a SP. I have cast 1/16-1/8 oz maribou jigs or in-line spinners and want to "switch" them out for a 500 SP to a suspended school of 20-30 (?) crappie near a fallen tree with branches in 20-25 deep feet of water and/or a bridge abutment (with depths from 30-50 feet deep) where the school could be suspended for their pre-spawn location. I would think casting to a school of crappie (if found) would result in a catch if retrieved at the proper speed and allow it to sink to the right depth... we'll find out if I have the right idea to put the odds in my favor.
Bink, you are right... fishing shallow currently would not pay off, the crappie are not there but suspended in deep water. Here in Maryland, there will be a migration by crappie to shallow water (10 feet and less) tree branch/weed beds in a couple weeks (maybe sooner with the early increase in temperatures ?) to spawn, but I am hoping they will be congested in the vicinity of the bridge until the shallow movement occurs. Since the local reservoir does not open for fishing for a couple weeks, I'm hoping to do my research prior to being on the water and fish in a logical manner based on the information you have shared since Buck's guidebook does cover trolling the 500 SP, but I did not find information that explained casting the 500 SP with it being so small. Fran and John, thanks for the explanation of the split ring... I never knew it rotated or about the damage to the spoonplug that can be caused. Steve, thanks for your comment about the loop knot... that was under consideration as being a monofilament version of a "snap" that would not interfere with the 500 SP wiggle and not be a tight knot to the split ring, but I am planning on using a smaller size snap with an improved clinch knot.
I know... I have a lot to learn and will when I am on the water spoonplugging, especially from all the mistakes I will be making but at least trying. Being so inexperienced/novice at spoonplugging that just the best learning experience will be casting/trolling the spoonplug when actually on the water, but, at this point I'm trying to anticipate problem areas (based on everything I'm reading and being confused/misunderstanding) and have a viable solution to solve it/them and be prepared. I''m trying to figure things out, but this is a good example why I posted the question to get opinions for possible solutions that others are aware of from their experience. Thank you all very much for all your help, I really appreciate it !

Bink · Post by **Bink** » Wed Mar 09, 2016 9:11 pm

What lake are you fishing? Can you post map?

NoMuskyJoe · Post by **NoMuskyJoe** » Wed Mar 09, 2016 9:54 pm

Bink, here is a link that will show the two different bridge locations (Brown bridge between 47 & 48 and the bridge for Route 29/between 23 & 24) on Rocky Gorge Reservoir:
https://www.wsscwater.com/files/live/si ... dammap.pdf

Here is a link to a corresponding map that will show the depth contours:
http://www.mgs.md.gov/reports/Rockygorg ... Plate2.pdf

Another interesting view is if you do an aerial view (google: Burtonsville, MD and then go north on route 29 to the bridge), and you see the sand/dirt "flats" 100-300 feet from the tree line edge due to the water drop off !

I'm assuming that those links will provide preliminary but associated information you could be interested in so you can check it out, unfortunately not on the Navionics map but maybe someday ? The bathymetric/depth map will give you an idea of the water depths at the bridges, shallow coves and breaklines in the area of the bridges... numerous places to troll a spoonplug ! I'm doing my research to figure out where and how to fish some spots and try to actually spoonplug them and see if there are any fish that I can catch if I spoonplug correctly.

This reservoir has: LMB, SMB, bluegills/sunfish, crappie, walleyes, stripers/hybrid stripers, northern pike, and hybrid muskies... I'm sure anything can be caught on a properly trolled spoonplug, especially a big one ! But, I plan on casting to the crappie, and maybe trolling the 500 SP over the deep water before I start bottom bumping just to understand the "wiggle"/feel of the SP what it is like, compared to actually trolling in shallow water.

Bink, if you or anyone else reading this forum have anymore questions/requests let me know... I'll try to respond and thanks for your feedback!

Bink · Post by **Bink** » Thu Mar 10, 2016 1:35 pm

on the information you have shared since Buck's guidebook does cover trolling the 500 SP, but I did not find information that explained casting the 500 SP with it being so small.

There's a reason it's not the best tool for the job. I troll a 500 a lot but cant think of the place I would ever use it to cast.

I plan on casting the 500 SP with a light action 6' / UL 9' rod, 4 lb test in hopes of catching my first fish on a SP. I have cast 1/16-1/8 oz maribou jigs or in-line spinners and want to "switch" them out for a 500 SP to a suspended school of 20-30 (?)

if the jigs work why switch to a spoonplug? Your rod/reel/line setup will make presenting the 500 a pain in the ass. If you know where the fish are and how to prestent a bait to them and catching them YOU ARE SPOONPLUGGING!!! You don't need to catch a fish on a spoonplug to be spoonplugging.

i plan 500 SP over the deep water before I start bottom bumping just to understand the "wiggle"/feel of the SP what it is like, compared to actually trolling in shallow water.

.
Nothing special in the wiggle of a sp. I Would almost advise the opposite. You will have much greater chance to catching a fish just dragging a SP over the Bottom of the lake than you will trying to run it suspended over deep water.

I know you have some serious limitations with the lakes and gear you have to fish and fish with.
Your lake looks great but without being able to troll with a gas motor and proper rod/reel it's really going to hinder your Spoonpling experience.
My advise would be to get out in you lake and map the crap out of it. Find the best looking bar you can and just stay there until you can understand how the fish use that structure and you can catch them. Once you have found a productive structure start looking for others that have similar features.
If your serious and want to learn... You Must go to lake that you can troll. I'v fished lake Anna witch is probably a couple hours from you. Go down there and rent a boat and you can learn in 1 day what's going to take a lot longer fishing your lake with its limitations.

NoMuskyJoe · Post by **NoMuskyJoe** » Sun Mar 20, 2016 10:18 pm

T9: Thanks for posting a photo of a crappie caught on a 500 SP and that you tied a knot to the split ring. I was wondering if a loop knot could be tied to the split ring, but was not sure since a small snap would be better.
Bink: Thanks for all your comments and I will provide a very general response so you can understand what a beginner at spoonplugging I am and that I need to learn a lot by spending time on the water and actually fishing with a spoonplug. I understand that I do not need to be trolling/casting a SP to be Spoonplugging, as long as I am properly fishing based on the SP concepts and structural locations. I am planning on casting a 500 SP to crappie that will school/suspend near a bridge column/abutment, over deep water. This would be similar to when I cast a marabou jig and allow it to sink and then retrieve it. The 500 SP would have a wiggle that the marabou jig does not, and I thought that would be a possible reason crappie would hit it from seeing other posts/photos that a crappie was caught on a 500 SP. I wanted to switch to a 500 SP to learn how to use it/cast it. Using an U/l rod and 4lb test makes it easier to cast, and it does cast similar to the 1/8 oz marabou jig. However, not the best setup if a 5lb bass, northern or musky will hit it ! That is why I will target crappie after catching a few on a marabou jig to know that crappie are in the area. I know that being limited only to paddling/using an electric trolling motor on the reservoir is not a good method to troll a SP because of the speed reduction, unless the bite requires a slow troll/retrieve when casting. Lake Anna is a great body of water, especially this time of year with the warm water discharge from the nuclear reactor. I've been very lucky to fish there several times ten years ago and wish I was closer. I agree with you it is a great man-made reservoir to fish. Attached is a page from the In-Fisherman Critical Concepts 2 book (2006) that gives a selection of the local MD bodies of water that are worth fishing because a 6lb bass can be caught, which listed Rocky Gorge. Sounds like a good reason to fish there to me.They did not list Lake Anna, that was a mistake! I will upgrade tackle to troll a SP, since an 800 SP and an U/L ros with 4lb test will not work. Bink, Thank you for all your posts and photos about your time on the water... I do learn alot from you, John Bales, Jim Duplex, Fran, Jim and Casey Shell, T9, Jerry Borst, and everyone else that posts a comment/photos about their time on the water and what they did to catch fish. I have so much respect for you all and how you all teach. I can only hope when I get out on the water that I can share similar information, but based on what I post somebody will have to explain what I did correctly since I probably won't have an idea... but that won't stop me from trying to catch a fish at the local reservoirs and if I do catch my first on a SP I'll be thrilled !

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