Although I've been through the study guide three times now, how to map a prospective site is not clear to me. As per pages 10 thru 16 of Vol. 7, Part 1, contour trolling with #500, #400 and #250 seems pretty straight forward. Also the first pass with the #200, dropping a marker on both sides of the bar. Shows the general shape.
In the study guide illustration on page 14, the breakline is already given. Great if it works out that way but what if you have no map, no sonar, no GPS. Just a lake with a prominant shoreline that changes direction?
No problem with additional straight trolling passes to further refine understanding the shape of the bar. No depth is given in Fig.3, so I guess I have to make some assumptions about the breakline. Lets assume trolling with #500 and #400 produce results as expected but not really revealing. When using the #250, at your desired speed, line length and diameter, the #250 starts walking at 9 ft., so you are contour trolling the 9 ft. level. You don't know this because the lure is supposed to troll from 6 ft. to 9 ft. For all you know it could be at 6 ft. If the breakline starts at 6 ft. and goes to 9 ft., how do you discern that it is there?
Apparently, my lack of understanding is associated with the vertical (depth) part of mapping but not so much with the horizontal (shape) of the feature.
In Fig.4 on page 16 of Vol. 7 Part 1, it shows the depths all around the bar. How are the depths discerned by trolling a lure? The #200 and #100 have a 3 ft. depth range, so from one end to the other is 6 ft. If the #200 walks at 11 ft. and the #100 walks at 13 ft., a 6 ft. break might be missed.
By what method does someone know what depth the the lure is running within its normal range? Assuming that you could even get depths indications as comprehensive as in Fig. 4, wouldn't you have to make at least 25 or 30 passes over the area?
Would it be possible for someone to describe the mapping procedure after the shallow water contour passes are complete? I seem to be stalled out here; not only from a study position but also a confidence one.
Ron
Not understanding
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Bill Patterson
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Jim Shell
- Site Admin
- Posts: 239
- Joined: Sun Feb 06, 2005 11:15 am
- Location: Illinois- the shit state
Ron,
Here’s my best in answering your questions:
“In the study guide illustration on page 14, the breakline is already given. Great if it works out that way but what if you have no map, no sonar, no GPS. Just a lake with a prominant shoreline that changes direction?”
The breakline shown on page 14 is shown because YOU mapped it in the example. This structure situation was found by contour trolling the shallows. After the shoreline bar was discovered a marker was thrown on the farthest point from shore. Markers are also thrown on the sides to help establish the general size and shape.
“No problem with additional straight trolling passes to further refine understanding the shape of the bar. No depth is given in Fig.3, so I guess I have to make some assumptions about the breakline. Lets assume trolling with #500 and #400 produce results as expected but not really revealing. When using the #250, at your desired speed, line length and diameter, the #250 starts walking at 9 ft., so you are contour trolling the 9 ft. level. You don't know this because the lure is supposed to troll from 6 ft. to 9 ft. For all you know it could be at 6 ft. If the breakline starts at 6 ft. and goes to 9 ft., how do you discern that it is there?”
If I misunderstood your question here, let me know…
The 250 series will run 6 to 9ft. One of the GREAT things about spoonplugs is your ability to CONTROL your depth EXCATLY. The range of a 250 is 6 to 9 feet. You can run a 250 on a short line to achieve 6 foot depth. A medium line length will get you to 7 to 8 feet. Then a few more layers will get you to 9 feet. If you’re new to this take some time to practice line lengths compared to running depths. Find some flats, notice the depths and choose the correct size spoonplug for that depth. Start with a short line and then SLOWLY let out some line until you start to tick the bottom. (see page 10 on volume 5)
“Apparently, my lack of understanding is associated with the vertical (depth) part of mapping but not so much with the horizontal (shape) of the feature.”
The “shape” of the feature is given by the breakline (vertical change). This breakline (vertical change) may be very noticeable or a bit more gradual to clearly notice. Once you get the hang of trolling the spoonplugs you’ll find these breaks/breaklines will be easier to interpret.
“In Fig.4 on page 16 of Vol. 7 Part 1, it shows the depths all around the bar. How are the depths discerned by trolling a lure? The #200 and #100 have a 3 ft. depth range, so from one end to the other is 6 ft. If the #200 walks at 11 ft. and the #100 walks at 13 ft., a 6 ft. break might be missed.
By what method does someone know what depth the the lure is running within its normal range? Assuming that you could even get depths indications as comprehensive as in Fig. 4, wouldn't you have to make at least 25 or 30 passes over the area?”
After you gat the hang of running the plugs as mentioned earlier you’ll recognize the breaklines. As far as how many passes you’ll need to make will vary. Make as many as you need too.
“Would it be possible for someone to describe the mapping procedure after the shallow water contour passes are complete? I seem to be stalled out here; not only from a study position but also a confidence one.”
Good question. Most new spoonpluggers run into trouble here. Follow the guidelines..no short cuts here. After you have contour trolled the shallows and discovered a structure (most likely a bar) THROW markers out! Place markers on the sides and the tip. Let’s use figure 3 in vol. 7 as our example. After you get a rough idea what the bar looks like and you have your markers out it’s time to make STRAIGHT line passes with the 100. make pass 1 as shown. The next pass will be made parallel to the first pass but slightly further out.(about a boat length from pass #1.) Keep on doing this till your subsequent trolling passes take you to the end of the structure. Depending on the size of the structure this may be several straight line passes to be made. As you make more passes you may have to let out more line to stay in contact with the bar or change to a deeper running spoonplug. As you are straining the structure in this straight line manor throw out additional markers if you notice anything. Also you may find out that you may have to reposition a marker already thrown. Reread pages 14 and 15. This is what Buck is talking about. Buck mentions using a fixed object on the shore to help establish your location on the water and to help you stay on track (straight line).
It may sound hard until you experience it on the water. Like anything else the more you practice the better you will get.
P.S.---Bill.. sorry if you had an earlier post that did not get discussed.
Jim
Here’s my best in answering your questions:
“In the study guide illustration on page 14, the breakline is already given. Great if it works out that way but what if you have no map, no sonar, no GPS. Just a lake with a prominant shoreline that changes direction?”
The breakline shown on page 14 is shown because YOU mapped it in the example. This structure situation was found by contour trolling the shallows. After the shoreline bar was discovered a marker was thrown on the farthest point from shore. Markers are also thrown on the sides to help establish the general size and shape.
“No problem with additional straight trolling passes to further refine understanding the shape of the bar. No depth is given in Fig.3, so I guess I have to make some assumptions about the breakline. Lets assume trolling with #500 and #400 produce results as expected but not really revealing. When using the #250, at your desired speed, line length and diameter, the #250 starts walking at 9 ft., so you are contour trolling the 9 ft. level. You don't know this because the lure is supposed to troll from 6 ft. to 9 ft. For all you know it could be at 6 ft. If the breakline starts at 6 ft. and goes to 9 ft., how do you discern that it is there?”
If I misunderstood your question here, let me know…
The 250 series will run 6 to 9ft. One of the GREAT things about spoonplugs is your ability to CONTROL your depth EXCATLY. The range of a 250 is 6 to 9 feet. You can run a 250 on a short line to achieve 6 foot depth. A medium line length will get you to 7 to 8 feet. Then a few more layers will get you to 9 feet. If you’re new to this take some time to practice line lengths compared to running depths. Find some flats, notice the depths and choose the correct size spoonplug for that depth. Start with a short line and then SLOWLY let out some line until you start to tick the bottom. (see page 10 on volume 5)
“Apparently, my lack of understanding is associated with the vertical (depth) part of mapping but not so much with the horizontal (shape) of the feature.”
The “shape” of the feature is given by the breakline (vertical change). This breakline (vertical change) may be very noticeable or a bit more gradual to clearly notice. Once you get the hang of trolling the spoonplugs you’ll find these breaks/breaklines will be easier to interpret.
“In Fig.4 on page 16 of Vol. 7 Part 1, it shows the depths all around the bar. How are the depths discerned by trolling a lure? The #200 and #100 have a 3 ft. depth range, so from one end to the other is 6 ft. If the #200 walks at 11 ft. and the #100 walks at 13 ft., a 6 ft. break might be missed.
By what method does someone know what depth the the lure is running within its normal range? Assuming that you could even get depths indications as comprehensive as in Fig. 4, wouldn't you have to make at least 25 or 30 passes over the area?”
After you gat the hang of running the plugs as mentioned earlier you’ll recognize the breaklines. As far as how many passes you’ll need to make will vary. Make as many as you need too.
“Would it be possible for someone to describe the mapping procedure after the shallow water contour passes are complete? I seem to be stalled out here; not only from a study position but also a confidence one.”
Good question. Most new spoonpluggers run into trouble here. Follow the guidelines..no short cuts here. After you have contour trolled the shallows and discovered a structure (most likely a bar) THROW markers out! Place markers on the sides and the tip. Let’s use figure 3 in vol. 7 as our example. After you get a rough idea what the bar looks like and you have your markers out it’s time to make STRAIGHT line passes with the 100. make pass 1 as shown. The next pass will be made parallel to the first pass but slightly further out.(about a boat length from pass #1.) Keep on doing this till your subsequent trolling passes take you to the end of the structure. Depending on the size of the structure this may be several straight line passes to be made. As you make more passes you may have to let out more line to stay in contact with the bar or change to a deeper running spoonplug. As you are straining the structure in this straight line manor throw out additional markers if you notice anything. Also you may find out that you may have to reposition a marker already thrown. Reread pages 14 and 15. This is what Buck is talking about. Buck mentions using a fixed object on the shore to help establish your location on the water and to help you stay on track (straight line).
It may sound hard until you experience it on the water. Like anything else the more you practice the better you will get.
P.S.---Bill.. sorry if you had an earlier post that did not get discussed.
Jim
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wr8o
Not understanding
OK Jim, I think you've given me an important part of the puzzle. So before I do any mapping, I need to check out lure depths by adjusting speed and line length. That would allow me to get to 1 ft. increments when trolling rather than being satisfied with a range of depths.
Assuming that now I know how to control the depth of my lures at 1 ft. increments, should I contour troll the shallows, adjusting speed and line length. for each 1 ft. increment down to 9 ft? I'm thinking that a close inspection might not be necessary to catch fish, nor to get an idea if there's anything worth further investigation there but might be necessary to find a shallow breakline. If it's shallow and the only one, I might as well move on anyway. Of course, I wouldn't know unless I investigated further.
Also your description of spacing (boat length) for the straight line passes with the #100 adds another piece of the puzzle. I don't mind putting in the time if I know what I'm doing. I'm guessing you use the #100, rather than the #200 and allow it to dig across the bar rather than walk. Then when it gets to 12 ft. it should start walking again down to 15 ft. Based on which lure, the speed and line length, anything the lure bumps into and relays back to you, is either the bar or a break on the bar at that level. How will I tell if it is the edge of the bar or boulders, etc?
My particular interest is finding the contact point, if one exists. That's what's confusing as I see trolling 1 ft. contours down into deep water as a method for finding fast breaks and contact points. I'm still not sure how to locate those important areas. I'm beginning to understand why my thinking was toward SONAR and GPS. I couldn't see how I was going to map the depths, so I adapted.
Finding that deep water in Fig. 4 by trolling would probably require the #800 and wire. Trying to operate at an exact depth 50 ft. and below seems difficult. Without being able to look down there, how would you know if what your lure is bumping into are bars at the intersection of feeder channel and main channel, deltas, etc?
Ron
Assuming that now I know how to control the depth of my lures at 1 ft. increments, should I contour troll the shallows, adjusting speed and line length. for each 1 ft. increment down to 9 ft? I'm thinking that a close inspection might not be necessary to catch fish, nor to get an idea if there's anything worth further investigation there but might be necessary to find a shallow breakline. If it's shallow and the only one, I might as well move on anyway. Of course, I wouldn't know unless I investigated further.
Also your description of spacing (boat length) for the straight line passes with the #100 adds another piece of the puzzle. I don't mind putting in the time if I know what I'm doing. I'm guessing you use the #100, rather than the #200 and allow it to dig across the bar rather than walk. Then when it gets to 12 ft. it should start walking again down to 15 ft. Based on which lure, the speed and line length, anything the lure bumps into and relays back to you, is either the bar or a break on the bar at that level. How will I tell if it is the edge of the bar or boulders, etc?
My particular interest is finding the contact point, if one exists. That's what's confusing as I see trolling 1 ft. contours down into deep water as a method for finding fast breaks and contact points. I'm still not sure how to locate those important areas. I'm beginning to understand why my thinking was toward SONAR and GPS. I couldn't see how I was going to map the depths, so I adapted.
Finding that deep water in Fig. 4 by trolling would probably require the #800 and wire. Trying to operate at an exact depth 50 ft. and below seems difficult. Without being able to look down there, how would you know if what your lure is bumping into are bars at the intersection of feeder channel and main channel, deltas, etc?
Ron
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Jim Shell
- Site Admin
- Posts: 239
- Joined: Sun Feb 06, 2005 11:15 am
- Location: Illinois- the shit state
Let me try to clear up a couple of things.
You don’t need check out the depths at every foot while working the shallows. The key here is to try to keep your spoonplug at the depth it’s running at. For example if you’re trolling the shallows with a #200 on a short line your spoonplug would be running at approximately 9 to 10 feet. You want to try to keep it at that depth. As you start to run free you slowly head towards the shallows. You want to keep the spoonplug very close to the bottom so you are occasionally ticking or walking the bottom. You don’t want to plow the bottom continuously. If you’re plowing the bottom you want to start heading towards deeper water.
Remember, Buck says to contour troll the shallows. When you get to the deeper stuff you then want to make STARIGHT line passes. These staright line passes will help you “see” whats down there. If you are just starting out don’t worry about mapping, finding the contact points and etc on the first few times out.
I remember reading in Bucks literature that you should first learn to troll the shallows, cast the shallows, troll deep water then cast deep water.
It all starts with trolling the shallows. Work the 500 and 400 til you get the hang of things. It could take you 1 hour or a month. Stick with it til you’re comfortable. Then use the 250 then 200 series. Don’t “RUSH” downstairs to work the deeper stuff until you get the hang of things in the shallows. Another tip of your just starting out….find a lake with GREAT water color. When you loose sight of your lure in 8” of water or less…that’s good water color.
You don’t need check out the depths at every foot while working the shallows. The key here is to try to keep your spoonplug at the depth it’s running at. For example if you’re trolling the shallows with a #200 on a short line your spoonplug would be running at approximately 9 to 10 feet. You want to try to keep it at that depth. As you start to run free you slowly head towards the shallows. You want to keep the spoonplug very close to the bottom so you are occasionally ticking or walking the bottom. You don’t want to plow the bottom continuously. If you’re plowing the bottom you want to start heading towards deeper water.
Remember, Buck says to contour troll the shallows. When you get to the deeper stuff you then want to make STARIGHT line passes. These staright line passes will help you “see” whats down there. If you are just starting out don’t worry about mapping, finding the contact points and etc on the first few times out.
I remember reading in Bucks literature that you should first learn to troll the shallows, cast the shallows, troll deep water then cast deep water.
It all starts with trolling the shallows. Work the 500 and 400 til you get the hang of things. It could take you 1 hour or a month. Stick with it til you’re comfortable. Then use the 250 then 200 series. Don’t “RUSH” downstairs to work the deeper stuff until you get the hang of things in the shallows. Another tip of your just starting out….find a lake with GREAT water color. When you loose sight of your lure in 8” of water or less…that’s good water color.
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wr8o
Not understanding
Jim:
Had a reply going but poof it's gone. Anyway, I'll take your advice and concentrate on the shallows. Still have some questions but maybe a little first hand experience will answer some.
Ron
Had a reply going but poof it's gone. Anyway, I'll take your advice and concentrate on the shallows. Still have some questions but maybe a little first hand experience will answer some.
Ron
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John Bales
- JB2
- Posts: 2518
- Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 8:51 pm
shallows
Ron, Jim has covered your questions well. Until you gain some confidence in the shallows, do not worry about going any deeper. All of us started out the same way. Turn the depth meter off. Feel what your lure is doing. Is it bumping ? If so, then begin turning out towards deeper water untill you begin to run free, and then turn back towards the shallows. Make your adjustments gradually. Slowly turn in and out. some days the fish want the lure running free and some days they want it walking. Learning how to troll the shallow is your first step in becoming a spoonplugger. Your interpretation begins in the shallows and you will get better from there. Do not worry about being perfect. If you do exactly what the book says and keep your lures in position, you will quickly begin to see why learning to troll the shallows is a must in the learning process. It may take you only a few trips to begin to see or it may take you a whole season. You must not go any further untill you learn how to run lures in the shallows. Put the gps away too. John
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Bill Patterson
Mapping
Thanks for the comments, Jim & John. I can agree that it may help to get the feel when 1st starting Spoonplugging to just cut the meter off. After that, I don't see where it hurts to glance at it once in a while. I have a question on finding breaklines while trolling (contour or straight line). How the heck do you know when you've found one? Most info I've seen says you can make a run from shallow to deep and they'll show up. I can see where this direction will help--if you lose contact with bottom, just let out more line. If it still doesn't bump, you may have found a breakline. But another theory is to run in from deep to shallow and look at meter. In this direction (with an LCD chart, esp) you can see see the bottom rise sharply if there's a breakline...and you're looking at the leading edge on the screen. If going from shallow to deep, wouldn't you be seeing the trailing edge of your cone? Anyhow, a few weeks ago I went to Falls Lake and at one area ran from channel to shallows and was happy to see two distinct breaklines. I'll check the further later to see if this continues for some distance. Then I'll try to see if my lures would have found these breaklines and exactly what I need to do for that method to work. Also found some delta areas- more than I knew was there. Next problem is that the feeder stream coming in is wide at this point and gently sloping. Not ideal delta situation in my opinion. I'll keep looking.
John, you can probably answer this--I know you love those Zercoms. I finally got one from Ebay last Fall. It works (easier to see than flasher, esp in sunlight) but the 'zither' function doesn't work (12 shades of gray). How much am I losing here, except for finding harder bottoms? Regular display may give me some indication of that (wider bottom returns). By the way, I called Tectronics and they no longer support the LCF-40. I had called them several years ago when Bass Pro still had 6 or 7 they were clearing out. Should have gotten one brand-new. At that time Tectronics said they would support them-but only as long as parts were available. Is this still a very useful aid even with no zither? Thanks guys!
John, you can probably answer this--I know you love those Zercoms. I finally got one from Ebay last Fall. It works (easier to see than flasher, esp in sunlight) but the 'zither' function doesn't work (12 shades of gray). How much am I losing here, except for finding harder bottoms? Regular display may give me some indication of that (wider bottom returns). By the way, I called Tectronics and they no longer support the LCF-40. I had called them several years ago when Bass Pro still had 6 or 7 they were clearing out. Should have gotten one brand-new. At that time Tectronics said they would support them-but only as long as parts were available. Is this still a very useful aid even with no zither? Thanks guys!
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Bill Patterson
Post
OK, I know someone can answer my question about the 'zither' function on a LCF-40. I doubt if it is a critical feature. My guess is that it's mostly useful to show hard/soft bottoms. I didn't get a new Zercom when I possibly could have. Got a 480x480 LCD instead, since the Zercom support looked like it was on the way out. It is gone now.
My questions about breaklines concerns...if I'm following a 12 foot breakline and the depth of the breakline changes... how will I know? I still think it's a good idea to look an area over with the depthfinder to know about what to expect. Then put the lures down there. Am I off-base here?
Thanks!!
My questions about breaklines concerns...if I'm following a 12 foot breakline and the depth of the breakline changes... how will I know? I still think it's a good idea to look an area over with the depthfinder to know about what to expect. Then put the lures down there. Am I off-base here?
Thanks!!
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pat maio
breaklines
Bill:
Just a couple of thoughts into the pot. John was on the money with his advice to turn the depthfinder offf occasionally and just troll the shallows. This is not only effective for finding breaklines but also will show you where bars, hard bottoms, rock piles and other features the depthfinder will not show clearly. Plus, looking at the shoreline when changes occur is definitely helpful. If your lure keeps running free at the same area/spot on successive passes this tells you that something has changed on the bottom.
Human nature has it that every spoonplugger will probably do things just slightly different. Whatever works or is comfortable. I have an LCD graph but I prefer the flasher to get a quick picture of the structure I'm working.Whenever I find something I think is interesting I'll make some rapid passes over the area. Going slow is confusing to me. I get a better picture of the structure at a brisk speed with no lure in the water. Shallow to deep or vice versa is easier to visualize in the mind. Breaklines show up instantly and in real time. The LCD gives a picture but not what the structure is actually like. Markers are a must when doing the above. With markers down and a good mental picture shown by the flasher you're now ready to put the metal down there.
Just a couple of thoughts into the pot. John was on the money with his advice to turn the depthfinder offf occasionally and just troll the shallows. This is not only effective for finding breaklines but also will show you where bars, hard bottoms, rock piles and other features the depthfinder will not show clearly. Plus, looking at the shoreline when changes occur is definitely helpful. If your lure keeps running free at the same area/spot on successive passes this tells you that something has changed on the bottom.
Human nature has it that every spoonplugger will probably do things just slightly different. Whatever works or is comfortable. I have an LCD graph but I prefer the flasher to get a quick picture of the structure I'm working.Whenever I find something I think is interesting I'll make some rapid passes over the area. Going slow is confusing to me. I get a better picture of the structure at a brisk speed with no lure in the water. Shallow to deep or vice versa is easier to visualize in the mind. Breaklines show up instantly and in real time. The LCD gives a picture but not what the structure is actually like. Markers are a must when doing the above. With markers down and a good mental picture shown by the flasher you're now ready to put the metal down there.
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John Bales
- JB2
- Posts: 2518
- Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 8:51 pm
interpretation of a breakline
We were raised on flashers. I cannot tell you how many of those hummingbirds we wore out. What a pain in the behind to see in the sun too. The old graph type units were way too slow for me. Now the graphs have a real time to the right of the unit and it works very well on showing breaklines. I have an eagle 480x480 and hardly ever use it, although it does just fine. It all depends on what a person gets used to. If it works for you, that is all that matters.
I prefer to look for breaklines by running from the shallows towards the deeper water although they show up going both directions. The most important thing is that you can identify one when you see it. Some people have a tendancy to think way too much during the learning process . Have patience and do not get frustrated. It will all come to you in time.
Some breaklines stick out like a sore thumb. A more rapid increase in depth is easy to see. Some are very sloping with a more gradual change in depth and not so easy to interpret.
If you run from the shallows towards the deep water and you are in ten feet and the bottom is very gradual with not much happening and then all of a sudden at 12 feet, it drops from 12 to 14 feet in a distance of a few feet, you should be able to interpret this as a breakline. You should be able to follow it and if there is a bar that exist there also, you should be able to follow that breakline around the bar and find its size and shape. This will identify any fingers that are there. If you cannot do this, then go back and re learn how to troll the shallows. In doing this, you are on and off of the breakline(without a lure in the water) but never very far off at any time.
When you get good at this, it will only take you a matter of minutes when you do locate a bar or whatever to interpret whatever is there. You will be able to stick your finger in the water and say" This is It"!!!!!!!!! Its as easy as falling off of a log. With a little practice.
Who cares if the depth of the breakline changes a little. You will be going on and off of it all the time and if it changes, you will see it right away and make the adjustment to stay on it.
Practice/practice/practice
Study/Study/Study
This is what it takes. John
I prefer to look for breaklines by running from the shallows towards the deeper water although they show up going both directions. The most important thing is that you can identify one when you see it. Some people have a tendancy to think way too much during the learning process . Have patience and do not get frustrated. It will all come to you in time.
Some breaklines stick out like a sore thumb. A more rapid increase in depth is easy to see. Some are very sloping with a more gradual change in depth and not so easy to interpret.
If you run from the shallows towards the deep water and you are in ten feet and the bottom is very gradual with not much happening and then all of a sudden at 12 feet, it drops from 12 to 14 feet in a distance of a few feet, you should be able to interpret this as a breakline. You should be able to follow it and if there is a bar that exist there also, you should be able to follow that breakline around the bar and find its size and shape. This will identify any fingers that are there. If you cannot do this, then go back and re learn how to troll the shallows. In doing this, you are on and off of the breakline(without a lure in the water) but never very far off at any time.
When you get good at this, it will only take you a matter of minutes when you do locate a bar or whatever to interpret whatever is there. You will be able to stick your finger in the water and say" This is It"!!!!!!!!! Its as easy as falling off of a log. With a little practice.
Who cares if the depth of the breakline changes a little. You will be going on and off of it all the time and if it changes, you will see it right away and make the adjustment to stay on it.
Practice/practice/practice
Study/Study/Study
This is what it takes. John
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pat maio
flashers
When I got back into fishing a couple years ago I was shocked to find thata Hummbird was not selling the flashers anymore. Panic is more like it, I guess. Anyway, I went to E-Bay and found Super 60s aplenty but all missing some component. I bought 6 for an average price of 30 bucks and finished with about 4 complete decent units. I know what you mean about the sun glare being a problem.
I mounted one in front of me and one to the side to give me a choice depending on the position of the sun. Working fine.
I have since learned that there are still a couple mfgrs making flashers so the panic has left.
Our lake is still iced up.
I mounted one in front of me and one to the side to give me a choice depending on the position of the sun. Working fine.
I have since learned that there are still a couple mfgrs making flashers so the panic has left.
Our lake is still iced up.
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Bill Patterson
Mapping
Thanks Pat & John! Your comments will help everyone who has questions (or soon will have). My 3 post attempts last night failed. Anyhow, I believe there are several methods to map a structure, depending on just what you're dealing with. Bars or a wide bar with fingers is one thing. A feature-less small bowl shaped lake is another. Somewhere in the N. Illinois newsletters Walt mentioned trolling around at a set depth (12 or 15 feet in the example) to just look for anything different...if the shoreline gave no indications of small features or past washes/cuts. The same article also had one guy driving (no lures this time) and calling out depth changes while the person in front was drawing a rough map and recording the info. Markers were thrown on interesting places to be checked afterwards--in detail. One tape says Mr. Perry would spend 1st day (on a large, strange lake) riding around and checking the 15 foot depth (I think the thinking here was that any bar that reached out that far would probably go on down further, whether or not the shoreline showed anything). This would eliminate 1/2 the lake. 2nd day eliminated most of the rest. 3rd day was testing 10 or 12 structures found. 4th day was "shooting the works" on the best couple of structure situations. Then, he had the lake 'in his back pocket'. Experience will show just how to best approach a structure to map it the best and quickest. Thanks again!!
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DouglasBush
To John Bales..."turning the depthfinder off"
Dear John,
I've aways felt that turning the depthfinder completely off was a mistake and I've debated this with Buck many times.
The first thing you know, with that thing turned off, is you're going to run up on something very shallow and either rip out the bottom of the boat or bust off the lower unit on the engine. The lures are maybe 30 yards behind the boat and the boat will hit an underwater obstruction long before the lures get there. I can personally show many roadbeds where this will happen if the depthfinder is not activated.
The depthfinder can be used as a navigational aid and looking at it while trolling is not an abomination. The lure back there is still doing the work and if the person follows the guidelines for trolling the shallows and the deep it doesnt matter if the gadget is on or off.
Absolutes like this are what scare many people away from the mechanical process of spoonplugging. Few people are going to jeopardize the expense of losing equipment just to conform to some dogma that doesnt take into account the many variables that exist in lake bottoms. The depthfinder is the tool to know exactly the depth the boat is in...the lures are the tools that fish the water and assist in the mapping process and confirm what the depthfinder is saying before the lures arrive on the bottom area just passed over.
I suggest that since you wore out so many flashers that you used them extensively also. Also, the beginner is the very one who SHOULD use the depthfinder to keep from destroying something and then even becoming more discouraged. He'll get enough of that from being hungup, marker buoy lines in the prop, etc etc to compound things by not knowing exactly where he is depthwise.
As usual, from me.....controversy.
Regards,
Douglas
I've aways felt that turning the depthfinder completely off was a mistake and I've debated this with Buck many times.
The first thing you know, with that thing turned off, is you're going to run up on something very shallow and either rip out the bottom of the boat or bust off the lower unit on the engine. The lures are maybe 30 yards behind the boat and the boat will hit an underwater obstruction long before the lures get there. I can personally show many roadbeds where this will happen if the depthfinder is not activated.
The depthfinder can be used as a navigational aid and looking at it while trolling is not an abomination. The lure back there is still doing the work and if the person follows the guidelines for trolling the shallows and the deep it doesnt matter if the gadget is on or off.
Absolutes like this are what scare many people away from the mechanical process of spoonplugging. Few people are going to jeopardize the expense of losing equipment just to conform to some dogma that doesnt take into account the many variables that exist in lake bottoms. The depthfinder is the tool to know exactly the depth the boat is in...the lures are the tools that fish the water and assist in the mapping process and confirm what the depthfinder is saying before the lures arrive on the bottom area just passed over.
I suggest that since you wore out so many flashers that you used them extensively also. Also, the beginner is the very one who SHOULD use the depthfinder to keep from destroying something and then even becoming more discouraged. He'll get enough of that from being hungup, marker buoy lines in the prop, etc etc to compound things by not knowing exactly where he is depthwise.
As usual, from me.....controversy.
Regards,
Douglas
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wr8o
Sonar/GPS
While I like the idea of learning via the study guide method, I will also be using the Sonar/GPS. Not as a substitute nor replacement for the nuts and bolts method but as an additional aid.
My Sonar/GPS (Sitex Profish II) has a adjustable shallow water and deep water alarm function. While paying attention off the stern of the boat, if the water below the boat recedes to 2 ft., the alarm sounds. This gives me a chance to slow down so my boat (17 ft Boston Whaler - 9 in. draft) won't run aground.
The Sonar/GPS unit also has a STRIKE function, so if I run across something ( Catch a Fish, Break, Hang, etc), it guides me right back to it and allows me to check it out.
More than anything else, that Sonar/GPS unit is what I look forward to using and provides much enjoyment along with fishing. My fun on the water would be diminished without it.
Ron
My Sonar/GPS (Sitex Profish II) has a adjustable shallow water and deep water alarm function. While paying attention off the stern of the boat, if the water below the boat recedes to 2 ft., the alarm sounds. This gives me a chance to slow down so my boat (17 ft Boston Whaler - 9 in. draft) won't run aground.
The Sonar/GPS unit also has a STRIKE function, so if I run across something ( Catch a Fish, Break, Hang, etc), it guides me right back to it and allows me to check it out.
More than anything else, that Sonar/GPS unit is what I look forward to using and provides much enjoyment along with fishing. My fun on the water would be diminished without it.
Ron