well, looks like we win!

[billmoody1]

Steve,
I too have a small business. I have it as an extra job. Very small as I can not afford to have any employee's. I have a carpet binding and serging business that could explode as the opportunities are there but big government and all the forms and taxes and insurance has held me back. I use this business to make extra money to go fishing. I will not expand as the incentive is too small. Anyone that talks should step into the shoes of a small business man before saying anything. EVERYONE that is a small business man down here in Texas that I've talked to is for small government and big incentive for jobs. We'll see what happens over the next 4 years. God Bless America and all of us. Bill

[MartyMcAvoy]

I have had my own Small Businesses as well... just to make a clear point. For those that can find it, or have FB or youtube... the November 7th Daily Show, w/John Stewart is Hilarious!! When the Blonde Newscaster of Fixed News ask Karl Rover.. Math that U do as a Republican to make yourself feel better!!!! I fell outa my chair laughing!! Apparently she didn't get the memo!! Let's call that Mithmatics! Fox has become BMN!! BullSh!t Mountain!! & when they laid out that ol boy, Sheldon (Vegas Billionaire) had to throw $100 Million at Romnesia, cause he had just given the Newt G. millions to defeat Romnesia in the Primary, Oops! & they had made the 30 min video, King of Bain!! Too Funny!!

[spoonpluggergino]

I tried to keep out of this but I am gong to chime in

By the way I DID BUILD MY BUSINESS and I am also a union contractor. The union does nothing to build my business, I am the one that I have to worry where my next job will come to keep my employees working I have to compete with non union contractors which it is a tough road to go. The union has no control over the customer, and this days no matter how good you are everything is the bottom line on determining if I get the next job or not, so most of the time we are at a breaking even or very small net profit. I do have excellent employees and that makes the difference. The union could care less if we go under or survive. They do nothing to help any business to stay alive they would close down any business instead of working with companies and look at both the employees and the employer.
We do 5 million dollars of business a year and you would think that I should have retired by now I am 67 years old and I am still working. Talking about Mr Obama not being in touch with small business he has no idea what we have to do to survive, after all what would he know he is nothing but a community organizer. All is good is how to distribute the wealth from hard working people, that we started from nothing and put long hard working hours, TALKING BEING OUT OF TOUCH HE KNOWS ALL ABOUT THAT. Maybe he should meet with his cabinet and figure how to creat jobs instead of playing golf and michelle taking expensive vacation on the taxpayer dime. By the way mr obama bought this election by giving freebes and gues who bank rolled his campaign, in case you do not know I let you in the secret THE REAL BOSSES THE UNION 500.000 MILLION DOLLARS. I WONDER WHERE THEY GOT THAT MONEY. All that money was aimed at Romney to make him look bad and demonized him and people like you with your head stuck in the sand believed all the lies that barry concutted. When barry introduce obama care our health insurance for all the people in the office went up a whopping 30 per cent, way to go barry, stuck to me again and more to come. Even after all this I provvide payed vacation to my employees including my union service techs and installers

We do not need big goverment

My parents came to this wolderful country in 1961 to give their children a better future. I am so grateful to my uncle for giving us a chance to come to the USA and give the opportunity of our lifetime.
We lived in our uncle basement, my mother was able to get a job at koufman as a seamstress for very meager wages but never complained, she was happy to have a job. My father was a janitor, he also did not make much money. My parents worked hard and in two years they were able to put a down payment on a small house My mother was told that ehen we first got here she could have gotten dood stamps and aid from the goverment she refused it, because she is a very proud human being and we managed to keep going with the litle we had. My father at the time was not here the first year, also he did not get a job right away. I remember not too long after we got here we needed a refrigerator I told my mom somehow we would find a way to buy an old refrigerator we ended up cleaning basements and pulling weeds out of a tomatoes field, one of my uncle friends give us the job and to this day I am very grateful for that kind act. We worked very hard and never complained my two brothers and sister they all went to college and became teachers. I joined the navy during the Viet Nam war and during my tour of duty which I served with great honors and promoted to the pay rate of e5 second class patit officer. The navy did give me an opportunity to figure out what I wanted to be and payed for my schooling when i got out. After working for 5 years I started my own business in commercial supermarket refrigeration.
Yes the goverment did help me to get started and I am grateful, but I also worked very hard to achieve my goals. I did not want to be a burden on the goverment for the rest of my life or abuse the sytem.
The way I see things is that lots of people they start to depend on the federal goverment so much that after while they loose sights of their goals and they think that is a way of life and the democratic party takes advantage of this. Yes Joe Biden accused the GOP that we all put back in chains, yha Joe you are exactly what you are doing to your democratic supporters, Talking abouut a Racist comment way to go Joe Biden
I do not hold bad feeling toward the democratic people we are all good Americans, but we need a leader that is honest and tell the people that we all need to work hard and not enticing them with free stuff and stop dividing the American people. With a heavy hart he has done that to my famly and some friends
I would love to know at what point this clown of president is going to accept responsibilities for his action. I am pretty sure he will blame President Bush for the next 4 years

I am proud of my mother she is 92 and a proud Repulican.

A final note
Italy is a democratic country but a socialistic values , I have a bunch of cousins they do not have jobs and no money. My cousin kids cannot get married because the could not support their family due to lack of jobs, but they have great health care

A Proud American, we Have the greates country on the planet

I love this country, God Bles us all
Gino

[spoonpluggergino]

Now you got me started one more thing

I love how you democrats blame President Bush for the housing bubble burst

How about to go back all the way to President Clinton that started with the Immgration dream act that also part of the dream act that every one should own a home. The democrat party had two senators in charge of the banks and made sure that everyone that applied for a loan it went throgh, and the banks did not have much to say about. By the way the senators were Chris Dods and Frank Barney both from the north east states. How about if this people were required to at least have a 20 per cent down payment and have a good job, maybe we would have been in better shape. Yes president Bush was also part of this and he should bear part of the blame

http://www.businessweek.com/the_thread/ ... drive.html
http://clinton5.nara.gov/WH/Accomplishm ... comps.html

General motors should have went through bankruptcy there are laws and other tools for a huge company to get restructured and start all over. What it came down to is our great emperor and chies bailed out the auto union for their money period to run is campaign like I said the first time was 60 million the second time 500.00 Millions from the auto union. We the taxpayers foot the bill for the bail out

I am done

Gino

[MartyMcAvoy]

I luv how U Retardpublicans want to exonerate Bush/Cheney for any wrong doing at all.. & here it is, Veterans Day... How many young men did they plant for their War Profiteering? Last time Gino... It was Obama wants us to stop fishing... then the Death Panels for the Elderly.. then the disrupting town meetings yellin & screamin idiots .. Bi-Partisan B.S.!! & U are wrong about Unions as well, they know if the business goes under, so do their dues... They don't do anything for your Business?! U Don't take advantage & advertise Union Contractor?! That alone can make the decision for many in yuour favor! If U believe that the Union doesn't care, U should go over the Business agent's head when there is an issue. Ask your Excellent Employees, they are that Union too! I expect its just another biased, unwarranted comment... Again & Typical. Well, its time to go watch Rover get his azz handed to him on BMN... "Is that Math U do as Republican to make yourself feel Better?!!" Possibly the Greatest Statement/Revelation Ever Made on Fixed News Network!! (BMN = BS Mountain)

[spoonpluggergino]

This is not a football game that you goathing that you win. I am sorry that you are attacking me by name calling . I love all my fellow men. As fur as our troops and soldiers there no one proweder men than I. On this day I fly my flag with great pride. I support my veterans and not just talk we send money to support their family. and for your information there is very litle help that the union can do for us, tell that to the corporation or decision maker they are looking for the lowest bid that can find and so most of the time a non union contractor will get the job. We are all Americans I would think that you would treat me the same. I have seen my wife in tears trying to make payroll and my hart goes to her. We have feelings to and we love this country as much as you do, we are just on the oppose side of the fence. years ago you posted on this forum and you called president Busch a village idiot, I did not appreciate that , I agues you may have got the best of me and lashed by calling Obama a clown.
No hard feeling just keep it civil

Thank You

Gino

[Steve Craig]

Gino,
Thanks for your fine post.
Dont pay any attention to ole Marty..... when he cant make a valid point, he usually resorts to name calling, and just rambles on in his posts.
It is just his way I guess.

[MartyMcAvoy]

Steve...LMAO!! U being Unable to Justify = Rambling on my End... Thanx So Much for the look into your past Gino... I am the 1st of All 5 Generations that did not have to Serve, yet I very nearly did... my Dad told me that if I didn't Have to Go... Don't! He is a WWII Vet, 88 years & still kickin'.. despite Breaking his Back in 5 Places in France as a Paratrooper, & having his hearing damaged by an Explosion, while laying there injured. Since then, any Paratrooper that lived into their 60s had to have Plastic Knees, he also has a Plastic Hip, Steel Pins in 1 Ankle, a 4-way By-Pass, & i almost forgot to mention he Bounced a Rubber Frog off his right eye fishing, (Not Hooked, just the 60+mph impact) when i was 8, (40 years ago) in Danbury, Wis. having a Cataract develope on it that makes it Double Dialated since... So we have as much Appreciation for the American Troops as Any1! U say I am attacking U... All I began this w/was... Looks Like We Win!! & FORWARD!!! & then it hit the Fan!! So No hard Feelings & Keep it Civil... OK my Fellow Americans, let's give that our Best & See what WE can Accomplish. ps. I am admitting to being incredibly envious of those beautiful Muskies I see U catching... 39" Northern is my best to date.

[r.david powell]

I WASN'T GOING TO GET INTO THIS BUT HAVE CHANGED MY MIND. 1ST OFF I AM NOT DEM. OR REP. I AM AN AMERICAN,I AM FOR THE GOOD OF THIS COUNTRY AS A WHOLE. ALL THE DAMN BICKERING OUT OF WASH. JUST MAKES ME HATE BOTH PARTIES. ONE BLAMES THE OTHER,WHEN IN REALITY IT IS BOTH PARTIES FAULT. I DONT CARE MUCH FOR OBAMA AND DIDN'T LIKE ROMNEY.STEVE MADE SOME COMMENTS ABOUT OBAMACARE.NOW I ADMIT I HAVE DONE VERY LITTLE RESEARCH .BUT WHAT I FOUND SEEMS TO DISAGREE WITH STEVE. LOOKS TO ME THE PART ABOUT 30HRS BEING A FULL WORK WEEK JUST MEANS IF YOU WORK SOMEONE 30 OR MORE HOURS /WK.HE IS TO BE A FULL TIME EMPOLEE. DOES NOT MEAN OVERTIME FOR OVER 30HRS/WK.BUT IT DOES MEAN THAT YOU HAVE TO PROVIDE HIM WITH HEALTH CARE. BUT ONLY IF YOU EMPLOY 50 OR MORE PEOPLE. STEVE IF I AM WRONG PLEASE SEND ME A LINK SO I MAY ENLIGHTEN MYSELF.I ALSO THINK YOU SAID YOU READ THIS BILL ,IT IS OVER 2000 PAGES LONG,SO I KINDA DOUBT THAT.

[Steve Craig]

Doubt all you want.........
I READ IT! And FWIW.....there are far more than 2000 pages!
So did my accountant!

So now i am being called a liar!
I will not do the work for you. Go read it yourself.

We are only touching the tip of this iceberg here. Pages 50- 152 tells you what all the illegal aliens get for free. Plus who (Acorn)determines who gets what as far as medical care, rationing, Exchanges, direct access to your and my bank accounts, how we cant sue if we have a problem, access to our medical records, this includes ALL documents, not just our medical, control of our HC provider, what doctors we can see, how much they can charge,even how much the doctor, can own, when you can have hospice and when you cant, pages 336-339 tells about our rationing, how we have to interview once we are senior citizens,not with a doctor, but with some dude in Washington(Acorn), end of life counseling, and who can order the end of our life! AND believe me it is NOT the doctor or you and I that determines this!
I dont have the time or the want to, to go any further here.

Just today, over 100 companies are laying off their employees, and either hiring them back at 29 hours, or hiring 2 back at 20 hours a week, or letting them go for good.

Want to have some fun.......google " full list of Obamacare Tax hikes"!!!
"No one making under $250,000 a year will be taxed".....my butt!
Read it for yourself...
This stuff is already law.

Watch what happens Jan 1 when you get your first paycheck for the year!
Going to be quite a bit less than you thought!

What goes around, comes around.Just like Israel choose a human King (Saul) to rule over them instead of God, 51% of the people of this nation has chosen their own ruler to rule over them. Israel suffered at Sauls hand and so will this nation for the choices we have made.
Elections have consequences.
Welcome to the Socialist States of America.

[MartyMcAvoy]

Still Going w/the Doom & Gloom... I see ol' Papa John has Stepped in it as well! 40 Acre Mansion, 22 Car Garage.. but a 14 CENTS/pizza is too much to ask... yea OK.. See how quick Peyton Manning & Jeff Gordon distance themselves from him!! The repubs called for pre-emptive lay-offs, another inept attempt to Blame the Pres/Dems. & now U are saying that Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now... ACORN is going to be in charge of Healthcare 'Dispensing', oh well, yea.. sure.. I can see that, Y wouldn't they??.. they're practically the same thing... Community Organizations, National Healthcare.. it seems u've been reading something that has been Altered to terrorize U... gee i wonder who/or what group might do something like that?? & your Over-Reaction to David's Post is to say the least, typical & consistent w/everything the Party of NO has instructed of its dwindling supporters. Have to Share this 1 about Romney... the only Presidential Candidate that Lost his Home State by a greater margin was in 1856... John Fremont who was accused of being a Cannibal!! lol!

[Steve Craig]

Marty,
Stay on point....you are all over the place again.
"reading something that was altered" !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
LOL!
I didnt write the gloom and doom that is in the HC bill. I didnt make this stuff up.
I didnt get this crap from some right wing site.
I GOT IT FROM THE AFFORDABLE CARE ACT, ALSO KNOW AS OBAMACARE!
It is already the law of the land.
I am just telling you what is in it.
After all, Nancy Pelosi said we needed to pass this bill before we would know what is in it!
Now we are starting to know.

Papa Johns and Applebee's didnt get a waiver from BO like McDonalds and almost 1500 other companies did.
My question is......since it has been determined by the US Supreme Court to be a TAX and not a penalty if we dont chose to get HC for our employees, how can one company get a wavier to not pay the tax and not another?
Problems coming down the pike here for sure.

If this thing is such a good thing for all of the country and "we the people", why in the wide, wide, world of sports did 20 states, including your own state of Indiana petition to succeed from the Union yesterday?

It is plain from some of your posts that you are extremely jealous of anyone that makes alot of money. After all, you keep pointing out little tidbits of how much money Papa John, Gino, and others make.
They are not breaking any laws. They simply know how to do so is all. They have the same opportunity as all of us have, and they took the ball and ran with it.
Others dont, for what ever reason, and they become angry and jealous of others doing it when they cant.
Why?
If you dont like them making money, then simply dont buy their product.
I make a little money. sometimes I make alot of money. sometimes I lose money.
I personally believe, my blessing of making money comes from my Creator. It is HE that gets me all my work. It is He that provides all that I have. It is He that blesses me. Otherwise, how can I have all this work, and havent advertised in 15 years?
It ALL comes from Him.
Sometimes people follow God and they receive blessings for doing so. Others dont.
Peyton Manning is also such a person.
To me money is like manure......it doesnt do any good unless you spread it around.

[TN Dave]

Steve and Gino,

Thanks for sharing your stories. Success comes from hard work not a government handout.

Yet again, Spoonpluggers, Steve has shared his hard earned knowledge with us. Do not be fooled, Steve is simply telling us what is in the law (Obama Care) that was passed by Congress.

TN Dave

[MartyMcAvoy]

I'm All Over the Place?!! Steve U are the 1 that is All Over the Place.. U are the 1 reading BS into it that is not being read by every1 else... Indiana is Loaded w/Repubs believing all this Nonsense along w/U! Hey U know what, Go.. Take the Damn Bush Clan Along w/ya.. & its a Deal! Already know U will be attempting to Cheat & Scam Jeb into the Whitehouse come 2016. Gravity is the Law too!! I don't hear U Bitchin about it?! I see McDonalds on the Same list of companies threatening to lay off people because the repubs didn't get their way.. TN Dave. Damn Straight Don't Appreciate your Implicative Comment, No 1 here is Looking for a Handout! This is the Same BS the Right carried on about, & has already been proven to be Nonsense! Jealous of people that make money.. NOT Hardly Steve! I am Pissed OFF that they think they are entitled to pay less Taxes than the Rest of US, Remember 'US' Steve?! U can be Certain I have a List of Companies, so many of which were attempting to influence how their employees voted prior to the election by making such threats, & just like Home Depot, their former CEO's Comments prevented many Union employees from shopping there the last 4 years! So wouldn't giving your employees an option for HC, be Spreading it around?! & Finally, any increase in the Cost of business(however minimal) be passed along in the Bill to the Customer?? God: Grant me the Courage to Change the Things I can, This Serenity to Accept the Things I cannot, & The Wisdom to Know the Difference.

[Steve Craig]

Marty,
I am sorry you do not understand.
"Spreading it around".
You and I have very different views of what that means.
In my case, I prefer to "spread it around" by making the money, and donating, giving, and spreading MY wealth(what God has given me) around to whom ever I feel moved to help. I donate to many different charities and on a regular basis.
It appears that you believe the right way to "spread it around", means that the Government "takes" it from me and "gives" it to who they want to. Mr. Obama, the community organizer in chief, tends to think the Federal Government does a better job of this.
I, however, disagree.
It is my belief I can do a far better job of "spreading it around" than they can.
When i employ a person, I am spreading it around. Especially right now when few can even find work.

My employees had a very good HC plan until the government decided that it wasnt good enough.
Now they get to find their own, and I still have to pay the tax on each one of them, plus if they dont get their own HC, then they pay the tax again too!
I have very good, loyal, and long time employees. There is a reason they have stayed with me for so long. There is a reason other paint companies employees constantly hit me up for a job. There is a reason my company is the #1 contractor in sales for Sherwin Williams out here. There is a reason my company is in the top 5 contractors with the Dunn Edwards paint company too!

You are correct, in that all these costs will certainly be passed along to the consumer.
They are NOT minimal, however!
My current calculations reveal that I will be charging my customers an average of $600 more per house painted, if I have to carry the cost of just a 4 man paint crews HC costs.
Or it breaks down to a 15 to 20% increase in cost per homeowner.
That is NOT a minimal increase in my book!

Having them buy their own HC, and me paying the Tax/fine, I only end up with a 1.5 to 2% increase to the customer.

OR:
I can lay them all off, hire them back and only give them each 20 hours a week, hire 4 more at 20 hours per week, and I can keep costs at the same levels they are now, so no increase to the customer.

Now, which one of these is better for my customers, and for me staying competitive, and staying in business? Remember, non of these are being instigated by me. It is being forced on me by Obamacare rules/regulations/laws.

Now multiply all this by every company and you and I are going to pay though the nose in every aspect of our lives, in every thing we have to purchase.

Also,
Just read this today........

"When the people find that they can vote themselves money,
that will herald the end of the republic." - Benjamin Franklin

"The American Republic will endure, until politicians realize
they can bribe the people with their own money." - Alexis de
Tocqueville (1805-1859)